Type II Counter Clash (CC2)

A Type II Counter Clash involves clash marks that have been transferred through multiple generations of the die-making or die-clashing process, producing design impressions that are even more removed from the original source than a Type I counter clash. Where a Type I counter clash is a second-generation transfer (a "clash of a clash"), a Type II counter clash involves additional stages of transfer, creating progressively fainter, more distorted, and more difficult-to-detect impressions. These are among the most esoteric varieties in error numismatics.

How Does It Happen?

The Type II counter clash mechanism builds on the same principles as Type I but introduces additional transfer stages. There are two primary pathways through which Type II counter clashes arise:

Pathway 1: Die-to-Die Multi-Generation Transfer

1. Primary clash: Dies A (obverse) and B (reverse) clash without a planchet, creating first-generation incuse marks on each die.
2. First counter clash: The dies clash again. The raised features from the primary clash marks (plus any residual relief from die wear and metal flow) transfer to the opposing die. This creates Type I counter clash marks.
3. Second counter clash: A third clash event occurs. The faint Type I counter clash marks -- already a second-generation transfer -- now transfer again. The resulting marks on subsequent coins are third-generation impressions: extraordinarily faint and distorted.

Pathway 2: Hub-to-Die Transfer of Clash Marks

1. Die clashes during production: A working die develops clash marks during coin production.
2. Hubbing process carries marks: When new working dies are made from a working hub, any surface anomalies on the hub can transfer to the new die. If a working hub was made from a master die that retained clash-related surface irregularities, those marks can propagate to new working dies.
3. Multi-stage propagation: The clash marks travel through the die-making chain: working die to working hub to new working die. Each transfer stage introduces further distortion and weakening of the marks.

Pathway 2 is particularly significant because it means that counter clash marks can appear on dies that were never themselves involved in a clash event. The marks are inherited from the die-making lineage rather than created by direct die-to-die contact.

The progressive degradation through each transfer stage is predictable:

How to Identify a Type II Counter Clash

Identifying Type II counter clashes requires advanced numismatic expertise and specialized equipment:

• Extreme faintness: Type II counter clash marks are significantly fainter than Type I marks, which are themselves fainter than primary clash marks. The marks exist at the threshold of visibility even under ideal conditions.
• Progressive distortion: Each transfer generation introduces additional distortion. Type II marks are more blurred, less geometrically precise, and smaller in scale than the corresponding Type I marks on the same coin or die pair.
• Orientation analysis: The orientation of the counter clash marks provides the critical diagnostic. In a Type I counter clash, the marks are a reflection of the same side's design (obverse echoes on the obverse). In a Type II counter clash, the orientation shifts again -- the marks reflect the opposing side's design, but at a different angle or position than primary clash marks. Careful geometric analysis of the mark orientation relative to the coin's design is essential.
• Position offset: Each generation of transfer shifts the mark position slightly. Type II marks are displaced from both the primary clash position and the Type I counter clash position, occupying a third distinct location on the coin surface.
• Multiple clash evidence: Type II counter clashes only exist on coins or dies that show evidence of multiple clash events. The presence of both primary clash marks and Type I counter clash marks is a prerequisite for Type II identification.

Identification Challenges

Type II counter clashes present formidable identification challenges:

• The marks are so faint that they can be confused with die fatigue, light surface abrasion, or imaging artifacts
• High-resolution photography at multiple lighting angles is necessary to confirm their presence
• The geometric analysis required to determine mark orientation and generation demands extensive experience with primary and Type I counter clash patterns
• No two Type II counter clashes are identical, so there is no simple visual template to match against

Notable Examples

Morgan Dollar Type II Counter Clashes

Morgan dollars are the primary series where Type II counter clashes have been documented and studied. The combination of deep relief designs, long die pair service lives, and extensive researcher attention makes the Morgan series the richest source of multi-generation counter clash data. Leroy Van Allen and A. George Mallis, authors of the VAM reference for Morgan dollars, cataloged numerous die pairs that show evidence of repeated clash events producing progressively more complex counter clash patterns.

Peace Dollar Multi-Generation Clashes

Peace dollars from the Philadelphia Mint, particularly the 1922 date (which had a mintage exceeding 51 million), used individual die pairs long enough to accumulate multiple clash events. Researchers have identified Type II counter clash marks on certain 1922 die pairs where the progression from primary clash through Type I and into Type II territory is traceable through the die state sequence.

Large Cent Hub Transfer Counter Clashes

Early U.S. large cents (1793-1857) provide evidence of Pathway 2 counter clashes -- marks transferred through the hub-to-die manufacturing chain. The relatively primitive die-making technology of the era introduced more surface irregularities at each transfer stage, and researchers studying die marriages in the early cent series have identified inherited clash marks on dies that never directly experienced a clash event.

Collecting Tips

• Advanced specialty: Type II counter clashes represent the deepest level of die clash scholarship. They are not a starting point for new collectors. Invest years in studying primary clashes and Type I counter clashes before attempting Type II attributions.
• Microscopy is essential: A quality stereo microscope at 20x-40x magnification is the minimum equipment required for Type II counter clash work. Digital microscopy with image stacking software provides the documentation resolution needed for credible attribution.
• VAM reference: For Morgan and Peace dollar collectors, the VAM reference and its online supplements (VAMworld.com) document known counter clash varieties. These serve as both attribution guides and training material for developing counter clash identification skills.
• CONECA resources: The Combined Organizations of Numismatic Error Collectors of America publishes research on counter clash mechanics and identification. Their periodical, Errorscope, has featured detailed articles on multi-generation counter clash theory and documented examples.
• Die state sequences: Building a die state sequence for a clash-prone die pair is the most reliable method for confirming Type II counter clashes. By assembling coins from progressive die states, researchers can trace the emergence and evolution of clash marks through multiple generations.
• Peer review: Given the extreme subtlety of Type II counter clashes, seek peer review from established die clash researchers before publishing an attribution. The numismatic community rightly applies a high evidentiary standard to these claims.

Related Error Types

• Type I Counter Clash (CC1) -- The prerequisite second-generation clash from which Type II clashes derive
• Die Clash (DCL) -- The fundamental clash mechanism underlying all counter clashes
• Typical Die Clash (TYC) -- The primary clash type that initiates the counter clash chain
• Atypical Die Clash (ADC) -- Unusual clash geometry that can complicate counter clash analysis
• Doubled Working Hub Obverse (WHO) -- Hub-stage error that also involves multi-step transfer of design anomalies